Do any of our gigsters have any tips for dealing effectively with and getting what you need from sound techs based on your own experiences?
Acoustic Guitar Talk |
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Ethel the Monkey |
How to work effectively with your sound tech |
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Heidi and I are having an interesting discussion about sound tech people on the Saturday thread, but I figured it might be interesting to see what some other people have to say on the subject.
Do any of our gigsters have any tips for dealing effectively with and getting what you need from sound techs based on your own experiences? |
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jazzalta |
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I'd fire the bastard.
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headache |
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"You know.. I worked in the theatre for {insert relevant time period}
before I learned that F***ingsoundtech was really THREE words!" 'Next to the stars,'' says one veteran observer, "sound people are the biggest prima donnas in the business." Q: What's the difference between a sound guy and God? A: God doesn't think he's a sound guy. Q: Why do sound guys say "check, one, two?" A: If they could count any higher, they'd be a lighting tech. |
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HellboundGreaser |
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Give em a dime bag. Most sound guys are stoners.
Give a man a fish and he can eat for a day. Teach a man to fish and he can sit in a boat, drink beer all day while you fool around with his old lady.
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Ethel the Monkey |
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So I guess the answer to my question would be "no". (There actually are some good sound techs out there, but many musicians are never fortunate enough to actually get to work with them.) |
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oldgeez |
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The problem with most people who call themselves sound techs is that they're not.Of the ones that really are, the really good ones have learned how to deal with and get along with all the musicians who "think" they are sound techs.
My advice for working effectively with a soundtech is to understand that if you have or find a good one, he/she is like gold. BE NICE!Also, understand that the way things sound on stage is completely different than what the FOH(front of house) mix(what the crowd hears) sounds like.If there are alot of open mics onstage(vocals, back up, mic'ed drum kit, mic'ed guitar and bass cabs, etc.)there are limits on the amount of stage volume and how much of "you" there can be in the mix. One of the biggest problems a sound tech has is the vocalist or guitarist who wants so much more of themselves in the monitor mix than anyone else.If they try to satisfy this person, everyone else will want their volumes increased so they can hear a decent mix. If this gets out of hand either the stage mix will be garbled and distorted so much no one can make out anything, there will be feedback problems or he will have to eq the monitor mix to death to control feedback, making it sound like crap.If none of these happens, you can run into a situation where the monitor mix is so loud it can actually drown out the FOH mix.This is a NIGHTMARE,and makes the p.a. impossible to control, especially in small places where he/she doesn't have the luxury to boost FOH.Before I understood just how involved a good mix can get, the few times we had a sound tech I used to get really hot when he would come onstage and start messing around with my amp. It sounded good onstage, so what was his problem?The problem was that low frequencies need a lot of volume to carry any distance.Sound also changes with distance. My amp sounded good on stage, but get back a few feet and it sounded like a chainsaw.One of the biggest things to understand about a good soundman is that he's listening to the mix as a whole, as compared to the guitar player listening to his amp, the vocalist to his vocals,the drummer and bassist grooving on each other, etc, etc.He's also hearing FOH instead of monitor mix.It's a delicate balancing act. Not everyone's going to get everything they want. Learn to compromise.If you think it's hard performing, walk a mile in a sound tech's shoes. Also, listen to your crowd, especially loyal fans that come to all your shows. They know what you sound like, as well as what's different about the way you sound.If they like the way you're sounding, the sound tech's probably doing a good job. Mike
The only thing nescessary for evil to thrive is for good men to do nothing www.soundclick.com/michaelbaker-us www.soundclick.com/mikebayker www.myspace.com/mikebayker |
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heid2 |
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Quote: HE HE Achy!! Me and the sound guy are buddies, but I don't think he likes Natalie because she's argued with him about things. He may have turned the guitar way up to spite her. Quote: That sounds like what happened here. But in this case our guitarist was such a pain in the arsssssssss about her guitar not being loud enough that I finally said something about it, when I should have just kept my mouth shut and kept goin because the mix was a lot better. I couldn't even hear my vocals through the moniter! (Something you said happens geez) Nat always want's her guitar blisteringly loud,(Which makes it hard to hear vocals) but to be honest the drummer couldn't hear her because the mix was so garbled and he kept messing up after he turned up the guitar. Everything was really garbled. First and second time we had performed at the same place everyone liked the way we sounded. He was the sound guy both times and I didn't say a word to him about turning anything up. I dunno, our guitarist is really a prima donna, and I have really thought about quitting and going back to my other stuff. I've worked for a long time on her stuff, and my stuff has suffered because of it. I really like the coffee house atmosphere better than the bars. The people have been really cool in both atmosphere's. But I feel like I'm in the wrong place. (Usually yelling and screaming in the bars, but in a good way... Quote: |
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rachaelpachel |
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Great thread you guys, I agree with so much of what you all posted, your stories and thoughts on the subject really resonate with me. I am lucky in that I don't often have to worry about any "volume" wars because I work in a duo, the rooms are smaller and require less volume, and there are less instruments to compete with. I do know that for our sound, it does sound very muffled back where we sit behind the speakers, and out front it sounds clear and crisp. We don't bother with monitors, so we just got used to listening to ourselves that way. Sometimes its a real treat to come out front and hear what you really sound like after hearing deep muffles. Cheers, Rach my music link ![]() |
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heid2 |
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What I would really like is an in ear moniter, at some point.
It really is nice to hear what you sound like on stage. But I understand what your saying Rachael. Quitting would give me a LOT more say about how things went. It would just be me and Joe working on music, and since we've been married 16 years and know each other well, I think it would work out better Quote: |
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d28andm1911a1 |
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Mostly I'm my own soundguy, and I'm not very good. One of the best I ever worked with was at the open mic at Ken's Jam. That guy from the church was good.
Home of:
'76 d28 '03 00-15 and others |
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heid2 |
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A guy I worked with when I did open Mics was worth his weight in Gold. He doesn't do metal though.
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oldgeez |
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What you are dealing with, Heidi, is the reason I quit the band scene. I struggled with it for twenty years, but as I got older the personality clashes and power struggles took their toll.I came to a point where I actually dreaded band practice, and the joy of performance was dulled by the anticipation of "what's coming next?".I finally ended up that the thing I loved to do the most became the source of all the stress in my life. So I went solo. Best decision I ever made,although I do miss playing with a band sometimes. There's an energy there that you really can't get playing solo.But that's what jamming is for
Mike
The only thing nescessary for evil to thrive is for good men to do nothing www.soundclick.com/michaelbaker-us www.soundclick.com/mikebayker www.myspace.com/mikebayker |
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heid2 |
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Quote: Exactly where I'm at... Quote: I'm sure I'll be at that point soon enough. Yeah, the group dynamic is something else, but with what has been happening it just isn't worth it to me... Quote: |
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Chilibill |
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I've worked with a lot of good sound techs and some not so good (not sure which category fits me). It takes good communication between the performer/player in reaching the desired sound.
For my personal use I've found that keeping the overall set-up pretty simple and effects to a minimum works best. Last October I played at Little Brother Jam (near Atlanta) and the guy who did the sound was one of the best (Nyles Lang). Using a condenser mic for your instrument in a recording studio works great but it takes some genuine savy with sound equipment to know how to use them in a performance setting. Nyles knows what he's doing. He had a condenser mic about 18 inches from my guitar and the sound coming thru the monitor made it feel like I was sitting in front of my guitar while listening to myself. This year I'm going to have a talk with him and take notes. |
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oldgeez |
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Anybody that can pull that off knows exactly what they're doing. Love to learn a few things from him myself!
Mike
The only thing nescessary for evil to thrive is for good men to do nothing www.soundclick.com/michaelbaker-us www.soundclick.com/mikebayker www.myspace.com/mikebayker |
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